*SPOILERS* Discounting PHF, how did Giorno rise to become...

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*SPOILERS* Discounting PHF, how did Giorno rise to become...

Postby Kira Kira » Wed Jul 06, 2016 6:50 pm

So, discounting Purple Haze Feedback, how do you think Giorno - a fifteen-year-old boy who wasn't even an officer and hadn't been in the gang that long - became the Boss of Passione? His charisma wouldn't have necessarily worked on people other than impressionable youngsters like Koichi and Buccellati, nor could he prove that he had killed Diavolo (or even that Diavolo was the Boss, since nobody knew who he was)?

I understand that Araki needed to give some closure to Giorno's goal, which had kind of been lost along the way of the plot focusing more on Buccellati and the gang's mission to protect Trish and fend off incoming Stand-using assassins... but, since the beginning of the story (as well as shortly before Buccellati left to hand Trish over to the Boss) appeared to imply that Giorno and Buccellati were going to gradually acquire power in the organisation before trying to get a lead on the elusive Boss' identity, it feels somewhat jarring that the ending makes an unspecified time-skip from Giorno and Polnareff and co. returning to the colosseum for Buccellati's body to Giorno sitting in a chair (with a fancy new suit!) already stationed as the Boss with Mista watching - with little to no explanation, making the ending feel a bit rushed.

(And that's not even taking into account the "Rolling Stones" epilogue chapter that's just oddly placed at the end of the fight and breaks the flow.)

NOTE: This is not an excuse thread to rag on Part 5. That was my little criticism, but this topic is predominantly for us to air our musings and theories as to how Giorno became the Boss. I understand that it'd probably be a bit boring to read an epilogue chapter about Giorno's bureaucratic dealings with the other superiors in Passione, and we don't actually know how much time passed between the fight with Diavolo and Giorno becoming the new Boss, but even still... the ending leaves one wanting, especially considering it gets nothing in the form of a follow-up in Part 6, bar an arrow segment that serves as backstory for a few characters' Stands, but it's not touched upon as a significant plot point (whereas even the other arcs have a character or element reappear - e.g. Part 2 is the most "sequel-y" Part IMO, with Speedwagon, Erina, Straizo, and the stone mask returning; Part 3 picks up where the last Part left off with Joseph and reintroduces Dio; Part 4 reintroduces Jotaro and Joseph; Part 5 reintroduces Koichi, Polnareff, and the arrows; even JoJolion has the Johnny Joestar flashback and the descendants of Norisuke Higashikata I from Part 7).

Anyway, enough rambling. What are your thoughts?
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Re: *SPOILERS* Discounting PHF, how did Giorno rise to becom

Postby Nabu-san » Wed Jul 06, 2016 7:14 pm

I think everyone would bow to GER's might. Simple as that.
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Re: *SPOILERS* Discounting PHF, how did Giorno rise to becom

Postby Kira Kira » Wed Jul 06, 2016 7:28 pm

Nabu-san wrote:I think everyone would bow to GER's might. Simple as that.


That's if he still had GER. Which I doubt.

Polnareff had activated Chariot Requiem once before (in that flashback), but it went back to regular Chariot when he took the arrow away from it. Since the arrow fell from GER's head after Diavolo is defeated, it's likely that GER went back to regular Gold Experience.

To back this up: http://jazztronic.tumblr.com/post/127745726228
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Re: *SPOILERS* Discounting PHF, how did Giorno rise to becom

Postby Nabu-san » Wed Jul 06, 2016 7:54 pm

I counterargue that Chariot didn't complete its transformation when Polnareff took the Arrow from it. Thus things were different.

When Chariot Requiem was complete, it could simply hold the Arrow in its hand.
When Diavolo disabled Chariot and properly stole the Arrow, Chariot didn't revert back.
GER might as well follow the same rules and still be active.
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Re: *SPOILERS* Discounting PHF, how did Giorno rise to becom

Postby Kyojo777 » Thu Jul 07, 2016 1:01 am

Nabu-san wrote:I counterargue that Chariot didn't complete its transformation when Polnareff took the Arrow from it. Thus things were different.

When Chariot Requiem was complete, it could simply hold the Arrow in its hand.
When Diavolo disabled Chariot and properly stole the Arrow, Chariot didn't revert back.
GER might as well follow the same rules and still be active.


I agree.

Inb4 ASB, cause there's an obvious reason for it being limited. Hell, in Purple Haze's chapter GERM (Get it? GERM?) lasted indefinitely.
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Re: *SPOILERS* Discounting PHF, how did Giorno rise to becom

Postby blind51de » Thu Jul 07, 2016 3:01 am

I assume most gangsters who knew the boss was some kind of monster would consider Giorno an even greater monster, GER or no.
It's a fair point though that Giorno's power base is lacking with just Mista and turtle-Polnareff, but Diavolo's entire cadre had been uprooted. The only major obstacle would've been the drugs crew that Giorno vowed to stop, and we know how that turned out.
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Re: *SPOILERS* Discounting PHF, how did Giorno rise to becom

Postby Kira Kira » Thu Jul 07, 2016 11:41 am

Nabu-san wrote:I counterargue that Chariot didn't complete its transformation when Polnareff took the Arrow from it. Thus things were different.

When Chariot Requiem was complete, it could simply hold the Arrow in its hand.
When Diavolo disabled Chariot and properly stole the Arrow, Chariot didn't revert back.
GER might as well follow the same rules and still be active.


Perhaps; it's plausible. I just think the purpose of the scene depicting the arrow falling was meant to show that Giorno had now lost GER. The only time we've ever seen GER is with the arrow in its head, and Giorno gave said arrow to Polnareff in the turtle for safekeeping, so that's enough for me to believe that he no longer has it.

blind51de wrote:I assume most gangsters who knew the boss was some kind of monster would consider Giorno an even greater monster, GER or no.
It's a fair point though that Giorno's power base is lacking with just Mista and turtle-Polnareff, but Diavolo's entire cadre had been uprooted. The only major obstacle would've been the drugs crew that Giorno vowed to stop, and we know how that turned out.


Yeah. Most of them didn't know what the Boss' Stand actually was, but Giorno, as well as his Gold Experience, is pretty ruthless in his own right.

And now that I think about it, the other gangsters could've made the (tenuous) link between a bunch of Passione members seemingly disappearing overnight (or five days). Also, they could've also just been grateful to not have a Boss that was so secretive and hypocritical about wanting people to trust him yet trusting no-one. A big part of how Giorno managed to win Buccellati and co. over is his ability to make people trust in him - not just because of his charisma, but because he proves it with his actions (e.g. counting on Abbacchio to solve Soft Machine's mystery by throwing himself directly into its line of danger; risking his life by infecting himself and Illuso with Purple Haze in order to rescue Fugo; that stuff with Narancia during the "Clash and Talking Head" arc).

So, they could've simply accepted the takeover. It's hard to believe, but so are a lot of things in Part 5.
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Re: *SPOILERS* Discounting PHF, how did Giorno rise to become...

Postby Giosuke » Wed Oct 05, 2016 6:10 am

Who really was left at a level to oppose he and Mista's authority? They maybe couldn't prove Diavolo's death but the fact that they finished off Cioccolata, Secco and Risotto(Kinda) might have struck fear in the hearts of everyone else.

This is not taking in account that if he has GER, which if he does there's not a damn thing anyone could do.
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Re: *SPOILERS* Discounting PHF, how did Giorno rise to become...

Postby mrsticky005 » Sun Dec 18, 2016 3:23 am

Contrary to being abrupt, Giorno finally becoming the boss of Passione was well deserved.
A lot of Part 5 is Giorno gaining the trust and respect of Bruno and his gang. Even though Bruno was the leader
it was clear that Giorno was his equal. Giorno became the leader for the exact opposite reason Diavolo did
because of trust.

And I don't think Giorno really needed to use GER as Mista is his right hand man.

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